Radiance Game Dev Podcast -the Introduction...and goodbye?

When I first heard that Theology Gaming's own, M. Joshua Cauller, was starting a new podcast, I decided to check it out. Why not? I am current on all the podcasts I follow, and even though I don't develop video games (the topic of the new podcast) I rather like video games, and I might just learn something interesting. So, I go to Radiance Game Dev, and start listening.
Now, a little aside, I like grand epics. When I see that a book series is only a trilogy, I am not sure I want to invest my time in it. If it has twenty, then I know that is a world I want to investigate. I tend to find a new podcast and listen from episode 1 to current. Poor podcasters suddenly get comment after comment from some dude they don't know on episodes they recorded years ago. The Scifi Christian must have thought they had an angry stalker for about a month as I caught up. So when I find a podcast and it only has six episodes (five when I started) I really feel like I am getting in on the ground floor.
However, what do I hear right off the bat? "This is a beta test, six episodes and we'll see."(that's my 'the Message' translation of what they say)

Enough about me. (as if there could ever be enough of me)(shut up, Rho)(right)

Radiance Game Dev podcast consists of M. Joshua Cauller, Michael Uzdavines, and Thomas Henshell hosting a discussion about games, and being a Christian developing games. Sounds kind of dull, to be honest, but instead it is a fascinating look into people. You know how there are plot-driven shows and character-driven shows? Well, this is a character-driven podcast. Game development is a device to get insight into these guys, and their guests. I didn't mention guests? Well, in four of the six episodes, they are joined by other Christian game developers who open up about their struggles. (and one episode where they are joined by an author) These can get surprisingly personal.
Episodes are from an hour to about one and a half hour. I'll admit that, at first, it was difficult for me to tell Michael and Thomas apart (I'd hard M Joshua before, so I recognized his voice) but by the end of three of four episodes, the confusion clears up (due in part to Canadian peculiarities of speech)
Anyway, on to what you all showed up for, the "interview". Now, to give you some insights, I send out emails with the questions, and get replies which I smush together to make a semi-coherent post...so this is less of an interview and more of the guys answering a survey. 

1: Why “Radiance”?

M.Joshua: Thomas came up with the name. It started with the idea that Christian game-makers are a little under-represented in the videogame space. As such, they're like a little light. That light can shine bright, but it comes with awareness and humility. They're not a giant flame by any means. 

Michael: It fits with the ideology we have that we are to be the light of Christ in everything we do. For us, that's making video games. Not necessarily in the subject matter, but in the way we run our companies, the content we include, and the way we interact with our audience. 

                    

Thomas: I see the world in a twilight, caught between light and darkness.  Gaming (both the product and the teams/environment that  make them) even more so, and moving towards deeper darkness.  It amazes me that no matter how much darkness there is, the smallest light can still travel (and penetrate) incredible distances.  My back yard overlooks a bay with a city about 10-15 miles away.  Yet I can see individual street lights, or a car’s head lights.  These are low power (voltage/wattage) lights and yet I can see them perfectly clear even in the darkest night.  Jesus told us to shine our light and we just don’t know how far he can make it go.  So as the moon radiates the sun’s light at night, so too do I want to radiate the Son’s light into gaming.

2: I’ve had an online friend stop playing video games because he needed to ‘put away childish things’. What value do you think games can have for Christian adults?

M.Joshua: I get that. But then I played Journey back in 2012. The game showed me that the world was ready to explore deep spiritual themes like pilgrimage and sacrifice for others. And then I noticed it wasn't just Journey, but a wealth of games. This got me writing about games for GameChurch. And long story short? That trajectory got Thomas and Michael to invite me into their podcast bubble.

Michael: To characterize an activity as childish has no real meaning to me. Simply because children commonly do something does not mean adults shouldn't. If you have fun coloring with crayons, why should you not do it just because it's "childish?" The time to put away video games is when they become an idol - when they interfere with our obligations or are prioirtized incorrectly. I've been there. Video games have value where they present truth. That comes in many shapes and sizes.

Thomas: Your friend needs to play better games. J ((editor's note- Thomas used a smiley face, but it translated over as "J"... I left them in as such because...well, I don't have a real good reason, I just did. If you see a floating "J", think "smile")) God built play into us.  It is part of the Creator’s essence and human experience (Episode 6 dives into this a bit).  Games are an art form.  In fact, I would posit they are the single hardest form of art to do well.  Symphonies have recognized composers, movies a director, but you don’t see this kind of recognition with the creators of games (outside of Sid Meier).  Why?  Besides the obvious answer they don’t put their name in the title like Sid J, it is because it is such a huge effort by so many multi-disciplinary teams to make a game it is hard to really say THIS person made it more than THAT person.  We often compare games to movies, but I think this is wrong in terms of scale.  In terms of cultural artifact and level of effort, they are more equivalent to Cathedrals.  Like the cathedrals of Europe, hundreds of man years, from a very diverse team, go into making that one single artifact.  And like the cathedrals of their time, for our time they represent enormous investments into what we as a culture value.   Games, like all art, offer an emotional experience.  Games, unlike any other art form before it, allow a self-guided experience into another world.  If that world is Mario, I can agree that is probably childish.  But what about the worlds of Rapture (Bioshock) or Thedas (Dragon Age Inquisition)?  Those worlds are wrestling with some profound questions, and offering some answers worthy of discussion.

3: With three hosts of your show, who ends up being the odd man out?

M.Joshua: Definitely me. We say I'm Elaine in the Seinfeld metaphor for our show. I'm the only non-game dev. And while I've dabbled in game dev tools – and have a long career in interactive design, I've never followed through on actually finishing a game. So a lot of my role on the show is just feeding that curiosity but also linking to listeners who might not be game-makers or followers of Jesus.

Michael: I think sometimes our guests. Somehow we managed six episodes with all-star guests, and every time we wanted to hear more from them. It's probably because the three of us can't keep our mouths shut.

Thomas: It’s a struggle to have three hosts, but we knew that going in.  I like the diversity of having two game devs, not just one voice speaking from that vantage.  I like that it isn’t ONLY game dev hosts, so M Josh’s view is equally important (especially for keeping the tone accessible for the broader enthusiast audience).  In editing I noticed Michael had the least air time, which I raised with him to see if we needed to change things to give him more room.  His answer was he is happy with his level of involvement and doesn’t see a problem.  There are advantages to being the wise old sage who only speaks after everyone has talked themselves out. J

4: You are on a desert island with one book: what is it?

M.Joshua: A blank book – with a pen or pencil that never runs out. The art of journaling, writing, and imagination is where I find myself most at rest; not to mention, in communion with The Spirit. And I never seem to have enough time to write. 

Michael: I'll call an audible and say one book besides the Bible - Time's Arrow by Martin Amis

Thomas: Since this is for a Christian audience, then I have to say “The Bible.”  Putting that aside, the real answer is Writing Fiction for Dummies.  That book is fantastic for inspiration.  From it, I would write more books and fill the island’s library. J

 

5: What is your favorite genre of video game?

M.Joshua: Single-screen couch multiplayer games with tactical role-playing and stealth. That's kind of a joke. Such a game doesn't exist. But it would get the most play in my house if it did exist. There's something almost sacred about playing games with your closest friends and family on a couch. And I really love tactical RPGs like XCOM and Banner Saga. But I also really love challenging stealth games like Deus Ex and Splinter Cell. 

Michael: I love many types of games, from RTS to Madden, PC or console, but the pinnacle for me is FPS Co-op.  Anytime we can LAN up a shooter I'm there.

Thomas: Strategy Management. It best feeds my empire-building megalomaniac tendencies.

6: Did you know you misspelled “Michael” on your web-site? (Micahel Uzdavines)

M.Joshua: Yes. That was intentional. We don't really like Michael and we try to butcher his name as much as possible. (Not really). Totally just a typo.

Michael: I know, my name always gets butchered.

Thomas: Clearly I’m waiting for Michael to actually read our website. J (Fixed, thanks)

7: Which World would you rather live in, Star Trek or Star Wars?

M.Joshua: Why isn't Mass Effect or Firefly an option? Can I mash those two up?

Michael: Star Trek: TNG.  However, I would not want to be on any Federation ship in deep space, because if you are, and you don't have a unique android, you have no chance of survival.

Thomas: Star Trek FTW!

8: Which technology or mystical ability would you most like to play with from that World in #7?

M.Joshua: I dunno, the biotic abilities in Mass Effect are vaguely similar to spiritual realities in like intense worship and stuff. So I think I'd be right at home with those.

Michael: Holodecks. I don't know what my colleagues answered but this is clearly the correct choice.

Thomas: Replicators.  I gotta know why if they can replicate anything from food to tools Deep Space 9 is still importing cargo like medical supplies and sending it out!  Something seems fishy here. 

9: Coffee or tea?

M.Joshua: Energy drinks. I've switched to the MiO Energy Water Enhancer stuff. And it's been a pretty good way to go

Michael: Tea, Earl Grey, hot. (See above, and it's not a joke)

Thomas:  Hate hot beverages.  Dr. Pepper FTW!

10: Your friends and family know you as a Geek because of what trait/tendency?

M.Joshua: Usually people don't really know what to do with me, I'm kind of a weird kid who likes whatever is least likely for my social sphere. So I don't know that "geek" quite works for me. 

Michael: My coffee mug shaped like Worf's head. 

Thomas: My awesome un-tan.  I’m as pasty white as you can get without being albino (I call it “programmer white” as if it’s a thing).  I wish they’d put tanning technology into monitors so I’d look normal.  J  But seriously, it is because I would rather play with my mind/imagination than my body.  This ability to enjoy the incorporeal verses the corporeal seems to separate the human race into geeks and non-geeks. 

11: Podcasting is as easy as sitting down and just talking, right? What is your biggest obstacle to podcasting?

M.Joshua: In the setup and creation, sure. But I find that the hardest aspect is finding an audience and knowing how to connect with them. It helps if you're inviting your ideal audience onto the show and interviewing them.

Michael: Editing, hands down. The work after the podcast is brutal.  I mean, I assume it is because Thomas always complains about it.

Thomas: Ha!  I wish!  And while I have listened to podcasts that are nothing more than that, that doesn’t meet my standard of excellence.  I believe if God calls you to do something he calls you to do it well (meaning to the best of your ability).  Each podcast averages about 15 hours of work per episode.  From the arranging of the guest, the pre-planning of the questions, key topics, deep dive game, to the recording, to the editing (some episodes take up to 8 hours of editing), to the final publishing with show notes, and then distribution.  Probably our two biggest obstacles are finding quality guests and scheduling 4 busy people to record the show.

12: If you had to pick one, which would it be: winter or summer?

M.Joshua: Probably Summer. But I'm always a paradox: wanting to be outside in the winter and inside during the summer. Wait, that's not true. I always want to be inside.  I just like saying I want to be outside.

Michael: Winter. I'm in south Florida, and it's the only time I can go outside without bursting into flames.

Thomas: Summer.  I love cycling and it is quite hard to do in the snow. 

13: How about a complex question…when did you stop kicking puppies?

M.Joshua: For me, it was just after I started punching walruses. I found that their soft padding made for a more comfortable violent experience.

Michael: I'm offended by that quesiton. I never kicked puppies. I kick kittens.

Thomas: The moment I discovered how delicious they are. 

14: Weird Al Yankovic has a song, “Lame Claim to Fame”, do you have a lame claim to fame?

M.Joshua:  In my senior year of High School, I got voted "Most Likely to Walk Into a Wall." No joke. 

Michael: I was an extra in "Any Given Sunday" and was about 2 feet from Pacino and Cameron Diaz.

Thomas: I’m famous for failing as a game dev.  My first gamasutra article about it has the highest number of comments ever. 

15: How important is listener feedback to a successful podcast?

M.Joshua: It's the lifeblood. I mean, if nobody listens, it's kinda self-serving. Right?

Michael: It's everything. We do the podcast because people seem to want to hear what we have to say, and that is humbling.

Thomas: There is a lot of guesswork involved in creation.  It probably isn’t immediately evident to the audience how important their interaction is.  For instance, we are trying to make a 60 minute show, but then we ended up making two 120 minute shows because we felt the content was just so good we couldn’t cut it all down into 60 minutes.  So how do we, as creators, know if this is a misstep?  We don’t unless the audience tells us.  Maybe we take for granted the games we mention as examples but we should explain them better.  Maybe the audience would like a weekly dev update on the games Michael and I are making.  Maybe we waste too much time at the beginning talking about what games we’re playing.  We simply don’t know the answers to these questions unless people take the time to tell us.   

16: What is your favorite fast food or fast food joint?

M.Joshua: Subway was my first job. And the place will always have a warm spot in my heart. Plus, I know the best ways to make some delicious off-menu subs.

Michael: This is like asking a parent which child is their favorite. At gunpoint I'd take cheese Krystals.

Thomas: I live in Canada and this chain moved out and I miss them so much! I can only visit them when I’m in the US, as my friend in St. Louis will recall.  Church’s Chicken.  That fried chicken is the BEST!

17: If you could learn one foreign language, that you don’t already have a working knowledge of, what would it be?

M.Joshua: Arabic. Started studying it with an Iraqui widow several years ago and didn't have the means to continue at the time. I think it would be fun to pick up again. Farsi and Hebrew would be a close second and third.

Michael: I took a few years of Japanese but lost all of it. It was an amazing language. I'd love to get proficient in it.

Thomas: Japanese.  I just love everything Japanese, from their culture, their food, their dress, even the way their language sounds.  If I could respawn as another race, it would be Japanese.  I joke with my Asian friends I’m an egg: white on the outside, yellow on the inside. 

18: You have a time machine, but you only get one use out of it: what is your destination?

M.Joshua: Is it a two-way trip? Rote Christian Answer Warning: I'd love to see Jesus and hear him teaching in his original language, Aramaic. I wouldn't understand what he's saying, but I think it would accentuate what he's doing. 

Michael: Wow. This is hard because I don't think I could go too far back before my skill set becomes useless. I'd probably just go back to early 2013 and buy copious amounts of Bitcoin.

Thomas: When Jesus appeared in the upper room to the disciples.  That was the moment when they knew, REALLY KNEW, he was the messiah.  I want to see the looks on their faces of bewilderment, of finally making the connection to all the things he said.  And then to hear the tone, afterwards, of Thomas’ “doubt”.  I think Thomas wanted to believe and it was his desire for what they said to be true that caused him to hesitate, you know, when something is too good to be true?  So he laid down the gauntlet of what he wanted to see.  Just like Gideon.  And then Jesus did it.  That must have been awesome and humiliating.

Non obligatory answer:

Florence 13^th century.  I’ve been to Florence today and I loved it.  I would love to see it in the actual medieval period.  The 1200’s are my favorite historical time period.  If I had a holodeck I would spend all my time in it.  I would have holo-addiction and require an intervention. J

19: Besides Radiance Game Dev podcast, what would you like the reader of this blog to know about?

M.Joshua: I do this thing I call GameCell at my house.  I get ten to fifteen guys together at my place to talk about life, God, and games. And then we play games. It's easily the most fruitful ministry-related thing I've done in my life and I'd love to help get other people involved or set-up with their own thing like it. I chronicle all of our get-togethers on my website, LoveSubverts.com.

Michael: I'm making a game called Heroes of Issachar.  It's a mix between FPS and city-builder. We're on Steam, although we haven't launched Early Access yet, and we're also licensed for PS4 and XB1. 

Thomas: I think what M Joshua is doing on LoveSubverts.com is really awesome.  I love his approach to “game evangelism” through game cell. 

And if it isn’t improper to plug my work, I would like them to know about my game ArchmageRises.com.  See, I was in a bible study a few months back and came across this Augustine statement that so perfectly sums up what my game is about: “The righteous will know a good the unrighteous will never know, and the unrighteous will know a sadness the righteous will never know”.  So much of our world looks the same to both the righteous and the unrighteous that someone can reasonably say “Is there really any practical difference to faith?”  What I mean is both the righteous and the unrighteous can experience the loss of a child.  Both the righteous and unrighteous experience the loss of a job.  Both the righteous and the unrighteous experience pleasure in sex.  So if faith matters so much, where is this difference?  This is what Augustine is addressing: there is good and joys in life that the unrighteous just won’t be able to touch.  Like a word from the Lord through a friend at the exact right moment.  And there is a sadness, loss, and despondency the righteous won’t experience, like the fear of imprisonment or violent death a mobster has to live with each day.  I believe I have come across a game mechanic that can tease out this theory in a fantasy role playing game.  It is a Christian game unlike any other, and a role playing game unlike any other.  I’m exploring themes the game industry is just playing at around moral choice and consequence.  My goal is to create an open world RPG that allows real player choice, but those choices fundamentally change the game’s world and your future player choices.  My artistic goal is to create a game where a player feels real actual regret over some of their previous choices.  Not the content curiosity driven “Oh I wonder what would have happened if I chose the blue pill”, but real regret, a “If I had to choose again, I would choose differently”. 

20: Is it safe?

M.Joshua: "Who said anything about safe? ‘Course he isn’t safe. But he’s good. He’s the King, I tell you." ― Mr. Beaver, The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe

Michael: Yes, it's safe, it's very safe, it's so safe you wouldn't believe it.

Thomas: I’m not sure if this refers to the podcast, or the thing I just referenced.  But in either case I’ll answer with the answer to Lucy in the Narnia books about Aslan: “Is he safe?  No!  But he is good.”  God isn’t safe.  You cannot encounter him without walking away changed (hopefully permanently).  But he is good!

Links for the show-

Radiance Game Dev Podcast 

Love Subverts 

Heroes of Issachar 

Archmage Rises